Support is a joke and considering leaving it's got that bad!

[LDHosting]

Personally, I don't think it's fair to bash people for performing an upgrade to a software version that is advertised as "Stable". If tonight's cPanel or OS update goes awry, will you expect help, or to simply be told that it is your own damn fault for running the update despite you only ever using Stable tiers? Ok, many that have been around for a while will know that with WHMCS it is best to wait, but not everyone will know this. Should we really bash people for selecting a "Stable" product and not assuming that it will actually act like a Beta?

 

i have tickets answered withing 24 hours when i submit them even as low priority

 

You keep saying this, easyhosting. Obviously that's great for yourself and your company and I hope it stays that way for you, but it it quite clear from the posts on the forum that there are many that are not getting this kind of turnaround. Honestly, it comes over a little like you are rubbing their noses in it.

 

If something happened to any of our installs tomorrow that prevented us from processing payments or orders and we were unable to reach support for 7 days+, how many of us would honestly sit back, relax and say that it doesn't matter?

 

We have used WHMCS for some time and in general it has been a great product. I certainly hope that whatever is going on there is resolved soon and that we will continue to use/support WHMCS in the future. I would be lying though if I said that these recent events didn't have us concerned.

 

Just my 2 cents.

Edited August 14, 2012 by LDHosting

[easyhosting]

Well then I guess Matt loves you more than others. WOW, STOP THE SHOW!!!! Matt replied ONCE in the past like 2 weeks. Congrats, this case is solved and closed. Now I guess since support is rocking, updates are flying out of the shop we can all rest. We can all rest because @easyhosting has his tickets answered in 24 hours (which is still too long BTW). I couldn't care less if your tickets are answered in 24 seconds, mine (and others) are neglected for far longer than yours. Maybe you are Matt, or a WHMCS employee, who knows.

 

And yes, the situation would still be here. The support of WHMCS has ALWAYS been slow (no matter what version you are running, or unless you are easyhosting). There is no excuse for waiting 10 days for a response. None at all. You may think so, which is fine, enjoy. But I refuse to wait that long. If Matt does not want to get his act together, I will happily start nagging cPanel.

 

 

i suggest you learn to calm down and READ the forums. i am not the only one that gets support tickets answered WITHIN 24 hours (take note when i said WITHIN)

[easyhosting]

Personally, I don't think it's fair to bash people for performing an upgrade to a software version that is advertised as "Stable". If tonight's cPanel or OS update goes awry, will you expect help, or to simply be told that it is your own damn fault for running the update despite you only ever using Stable tiers? Ok, many that have been around for a while will know that with WHMCS it is best to wait, but not everyone will know this. Should we really bash people for selecting a "Stable" product and not assuming that it will actually act like a Beta?

 

 

 

You keep saying this, easyhosting. Obviously that's great for yourself and your company and I hope it stays that way for you, but it it quite clear from the posts on the forum that there are many that are not getting this kind of turnaround. Honestly, it comes over a little like you are rubbing their noses in it.

 

If something happened to any of our installs tomorrow that prevented us from processing payments or orders and we were unable to reach support for 7 days+, how many of us would honestly sit back, relax and say that it doesn't matter?

 

We have used WHMCS for some time and in general it has been a great product. I certainly hope that whatever is going on there is resolved soon and that we will continue to use/support WHMCS in the future. I would be lying though if I said that these recent events didn't have us concerned.

 

Just my 2 cents.

 

i am not the one ranting a raving. i am the one explaining the best way to go about the upgrading process so it does not effect your business and i am not the only one that gets support answered within 24 hours if you read through the forums.

[LDHosting]

i am not the one ranting a raving. i am the one explaining the best way to go about the upgrading process so it does not effect your business and i am not the only one that gets support answered within 24 hours if you read through the forums.

 

I know, and I agree that ranting on the forum isn't going to do much (particularly as staff rarely seem to post here at the moment). I'm also not trying to suggest that you are alone in receiving timely support responses or that you are receiving some kind of special treatment. I can empathise with those people though and, to a degree, understand why they are angry.

 

Until recently, we've never had to wait long for support responses either. To be fair, we have only recently had 1 instance where we had to wait a while for a response (7 days). However, having had the 1 reply go 7 days without a response, I can believe that it is happening to others too.

 

Whatever our thoughts on waiting to upgrade might be (for the record, we have waited too), these people upgraded to what they were told was a Stable product. In some cases this seemed to result in them not being able to process payments or orders properly and they were left completely high and dry (no responses to tickets, no patches released etc).

 

Imagine that tomorrow something happens that absolutely requires WHMCS support to intervene (I don't know, your main payment processor made an undocumented API change and now all your payments are failing. The licensing servers have been down and you can't validate your install to accept orders. *Insert other scenario here*) but they're not answering your tickets. Ok, I agree that something like that happening is unlikely, but it's not outside the realms of possibility and would put us all in the same boat (a non functioning WHMCS resulting in a non functioning business).

 

I honestly think that we would all be singing a different tune if we were in their positions.

[easyhosting]

I know, and I agree that ranting on the forum isn't going to do much (particularly as staff rarely seem to post here at the moment). I'm also not trying to suggest that you are alone in receiving timely support responses or that you are receiving some kind of special treatment. I can empathise with those people though and, to a degree, understand why they are angry.

 

Until recently, we've never had to wait long for support responses either. To be fair, we have only recently had 1 instance where we had to wait a while for a response (7 days). However, having had the 1 reply go 7 days without a response, I can believe that it is happening to others too.

 

Whatever our thoughts on waiting to upgrade might be (for the record, we have waited too), these people upgraded to what they were told was a Stable product. In some cases this seemed to result in them not being able to process payments or orders properly and they were left completely high and dry (no responses to tickets, no patches released etc).

 

Imagine that tomorrow something happens that absolutely requires WHMCS support to intervene (I don't know, your main payment processor made an undocumented API change and now all your payments are failing. The licensing servers have been down and you can't validate your install to accept orders. *Insert other scenario here*) but they're not answering your tickets. Ok, I agree that something like that happening is unlikely, but it's not outside the realms of possibility and would put us all in the same boat (a non functioning WHMCS resulting in a non functioning business).

 

I honestly think that we would all be singing a different tune if we were in their positions.

 

the main issue with 5.1.2 is that while in Beta as the same in a dev licence, you are not using it in a production enviroment, so cant fully test the order process. the lack of support/whmcs staff started when they announced the cpanel partnership.

[Roger]

Well then I guess Matt loves you more than others. WOW, STOP THE SHOW!!!! Matt replied ONCE in the past like 2 weeks. Congrats, this case is solved and closed. Now I guess since support is rocking, updates are flying out of the shop we can all rest. We can all rest because @easyhosting has his tickets answered in 24 hours (which is still too long BTW). I couldn't care less if your tickets are answered in 24 seconds, mine (and others) are neglected for far longer than yours. Maybe you are Matt, or a WHMCS employee, who knows.

 

And yes, the situation would still be here. The support of WHMCS has ALWAYS been slow (no matter what version you are running, or unless you are easyhosting). There is no excuse for waiting 10 days for a response. None at all. You may think so, which is fine, enjoy. But I refuse to wait that long. If Matt does not want to get his act together, I will happily start nagging cPanel.

Well... I believe I'd like to hear from Matt and team almost as much as I'd like to hear silence from you.

[Moc]

I agree with expecting a stable release, but does that mean that you don't even need to backup before upgrading? A simple quick-backup on the WHMCS installation would have saved a lot of this trouble. Yes one would maybe lose max. 24 hours of changes but those consequences shouldn't weigh up to the struggle people are dealing with now.

 

Yes you are relying on WHMCS, but that is what you chose for. If you don't want to rely on others, build your own system. I know it isn't that simple, but if you look at it rationally, that's just the way it is.

[easyhosting]

I agree with expecting a stable release, but does that mean that you don't even need to backup before upgrading?

 

even when you read the upgrade instructions it will tell you to BACKUP before upgrading. this in itself is plain common sense. ALWAYS backup BEFORE doing any upgrades or file changes.

[Troy]

even when you read the upgrade instructions it will tell you to BACKUP before upgrading. this in itself is plain common sense. ALWAYS backup BEFORE doing any upgrades or file changes.

 

Doesn't matter that you backed up if you discover a problem a day or a week after installing, after having orders, invoices, domain registrations and transfers, etc. added to your database. It's not necessarily easy to roll back and rebuild that data. That's when you rely on the Vendor for support and a fix, and when the Vendor is suddenly inaccessible and uncommunicative, you start grumbling. It's perfectly natural, and I for one get tired of your chronic need to respond and assert your superior views.

 

This is just like when you bent over backwards to defend wwesn who couldn't properly complete a 24-hour integration for me in over two months.

 

I didn't upgrade to 5.1.2 either, and am qlad, but I'm not going to gloat about it to these folks who have unfortunately taken WHMCS at its word that 5.1.2 is a stable release and have upgraded, and suddenly find themselves with serious problems and no support. Rather, I'm concerned that all of the hard work and customization I've put into our WHMCS, which is the heart of our business, might have to be abandoned if something doesn't improve.

 

It should be unnerving to you and all of us that WHMCS gets seriously hacked, then rushes out a new release, announces a cPanel investment (which seemed like a good thing to me at the time) and then cannot provide timely support. I'm sure the volume of complaints would be nothing compared to what it is, if only Matt would provide a more detailed indication of what is going on, rather than popping in about once a week with a short blurb that says nothing and does nothing to calm the unease.

 

I remain a big fan of WHMCS, as it has served us exceptionally well since 2004. However, I don't think even you can be 100% confident right now in the product. I haven't yet stuck my neck out in any of these complaining threads, but every day I visit and read new threads, and it's guaranteed that many of them will be from you, seemingly with some sort of need to put others in their place for not singing high praise to WHMCS instead of grumbling about the current circumstances. Frankly, I think it is you who drives people to complain louder.

 

Take a step back and put yourself into others' shoes instead of constantly berating them. Have some sympathy for WHMCS customers who have paid for a product that suddenly is falling down for them, with apparently no concern on the part of the Vendor. I know Matt and company are probably (I hope) trying to work everything out, but since you've been using WHMCS, how many times have serious bugs in new releases remained uncorrected for so long?

 

I remain hopeful that this will all blow over, and hopefully soon. However, I cannot say I'm not concerned about the current state of affairs, and I doubt you can either. My guess is you'd be complaining too, just like you are about WHMCSBB, if you found yourself in a similar predicament. Just because you haven't upgraded to 5.1.2 doesn't give you the right to berate folks who have and are now facing problems, and are posting about it because they feel they have nowhere else to turn.

[easyhosting]

Doesn't matter that you backed up if you discover a problem a day or a week after installing, after having orders, invoices, domain registrations and transfers, etc. added to your database. It's not necessarily easy to roll back and rebuild that data. That's when you rely on the Vendor for support and a fix, and when the Vendor is suddenly inaccessible and uncommunicative, you start grumbling. It's perfectly natural, and I for one get tired of your chronic need to respond and assert your superior views.

 

It is WHMCS and even others ( CE, Hostbill etc,) that tell anyone upgrading or amending files to make a backup beforehand. it is also mentions many times on these forums that its best to test new upgrades before making production, but you can also find on the forum the amount of users who have used beta versions on production, so their are many on here that just cant read or understand.

 

 

I didn't upgrade to 5.1.2 either, and am qlad, but I'm not going to gloat about it to these folks who have unfortunately taken WHMCS at its word that 5.1.2 is a stable release and have upgraded, and suddenly find themselves with serious problems and no support. Rather, I'm concerned that all of the hard work and customization I've put into our WHMCS, which is the heart of our business, might have to be abandoned if something doesn't improve.

this is why i spent $45 on a development licence (as i dont get my licence direct from WHMCS) so that i can beta test and then test new stable releases before placing in production.

 

 

Take a step back and put yourself into others' shoes instead of constantly berating them. Have some sympathy for WHMCS customers who have paid for a product that suddenly is falling down for them, with apparently no concern on the part of the Vendor. I know Matt and company are probably (I hope) trying to work everything out, but since you've been using WHMCS, how many times have serious bugs in new releases remained uncorrected for so long?

 

i have some sympathy, but do you think screaming at each other on here is going to help as we are all in the same boat. this all started after the cPanel partnership announcement and has has lit many short fuses with their members. If i have not spend so much money on customisations etc. i would have moved to another provider after the hostgator issue. i have no immediate plans to upgrade to 5.1.2.

[Troy]

It is WHMCS and even others ( CE, Hostbill etc,) that tell anyone upgrading or amending files to make a backup beforehand. it is also mentions many times on these forums that its best to test new upgrades before making production, but you can also find on the forum the amount of users who have used beta versions on production, so their are many on here that just cant read or understand.

 

You seem to have completely missed my point, which was: It doesn't matter if you've backed up before upgrading if you have had orders, payments, domain registrations and transfers and whatever else happen after the upgrade and backup. If you're a moderately busy host, your data has changed, and reverting to the backup would necessitate that you rebuild a lot of data potentially. In this case you expect to be able to rely on WHMCS to help sort out the issue and make sure you're up and running in at least a semi-manageable fashion with the new version, and when that doesn't happen, the complaints are warranted.

 

The complaints escalate in part because you are here continually bashing the complainers.

 

At any rate, I won't directly respond to you any longer because I know you have to have the last word, so this is it for me.

 

I just came here to support those who are having issues and are upset at what has happened to WHMCS support.

[easyhosting]

You seem to have completely missed my point, which was: It doesn't matter if you've backed up before upgrading if you have had orders, payments, domain registrations and transfers and whatever else happen after the upgrade and backup. If you're a moderately busy host, your data has changed, and reverting to the backup would necessitate that you rebuild a lot of data potentially.

 

not really. if you have a db backup setup that will do this daily then if you need to revert back to 5.0.3 then you can still use the last daily DB which should hold all changes made etc.

 

but if you had CE, Hostbill etc you would still have the same issue.

[Troy]

not really. if you have a db backup setup that will do this daily then if you need to revert back to 5.0.3 then you can still use the last daily DB which should hold all changes made etc.

 

but if you had CE, Hostbill etc you would still have the same issue.

 

<groan> (and kicking myself for allowing you to bait me again.)

 

Okay, so consider this scenario:

 

1. I backup WHMCS 5.0.3 and upgrade to 5.1.2.

2. Over the course of several days I have 13 hosting orders, 9 domain registrations, 3 domain transfers, and 74 invoice payments.

3. I discover a critical bug in 5.1.2.

4. You suggest I roll back to the 5.0.3 backup and then overwrite the database with the 5.1.2 data?

 

Have you considered the fact that the database structure has changed between versions? I ran a comparison tool and found differences in the schema of half a dozen core tables. I also noticed that in addition to those tables, some mods we use, (including your beloved WHMCSBB), have modified CORE WHMCS tables like tblClients, (which is probably a bad idea, but it is what it is.) There would be a potential mess bigger than the 5.1.2 mess caused by overwriting a 5.0.3 database with 5.1.2 data.

 

Now granted, some database differences that I've found comparing a stock 5.1.2 to our 5.0.3 wouldn't be an issue, such as the WHMCSBB fields in tblclients, they'd just be carried forward in an upgrade, and would be there in 5.1.2. However, there are some differences that could be problematic, such as:

 

tblproducts.overagesenabled is int(1) in our 5.0.3 database, but varchar(10) in stock 5.1.2. The 5.1.2 upgrade probably took care of converting data, but overwriting a 5.0.3 database with 5.1.2 could cause 5.0.3 to not be able to read this column and overusage billing could be problematic. I haven't looked at the actual data, but some fields like this are set to "on" rather than a boolean or numeric value, which would likely cause problems.

 

tbltickets.tid is int(6) in our 5.0.3 database, and varchar(15) in 5.1.2. Could cause major problem for support tickets, or could be okay with php's loose variable typing.

 

tblcalendar dropped 7 columns and added 3 since 5.0.3

 

tbldomains has two extra fields in 5.1.2.

 

Not to mention Matt himself has posted on these forums that doing this is a BAD idea.

Edited August 15, 2012 by Troy
Minor clarification

[easyhosting]

<groan> (and kicking myself for allowing you to bait me again.)

 

Okay, so consider this scenario:

 

1. I backup WHMCS 5.0.3 and upgrade to 5.1.2.

2. Over the course of several days I have 13 hosting orders, 9 domain registrations, 3 domain transfers, and 74 invoice payments.

3. I discover a critical bug in 5.1.2.

4. You suggest I roll back to the 5.0.3 backup and then overwrite the database with the 5.1.2 data?

 

Have you considered the fact that the database structure has changed between versions? I ran a comparison tool and found differences in the schema of half a dozen core tables. I also noticed that in addition to those tables, some mods we use, (including your beloved WHMCSBB), have modified CORE WHMCS tables like tblClients, (which is probably a bad idea, but it is what it is.) There would be a potential mess bigger than the 5.1.2 mess caused by overwriting a 5.0.3 database with 5.1.2 data.

 

 

i did this in my dev licence and found no real issue, but then again a dev licence is the same as beta and not tested or run in production.

 

so you use WHMCSBB then can you explain that when i first installed this i set this up with an admin username so i can work as an admin within the forum, but over the last few weeks the admin username has changed several times, but no access to the forum admin account.

[panacheweb]

I agree there are many serious bitches with support and 5.1.2.. I can say Matt finally upgraded to ioncube 7 after I bitched at him about using an older version of ioncube that was so easily cracked and decoded. While I understand about some files should not be encoded.. I like others know that all files that are encoded can be decoded. It just makes it a little more difficult for people to decode the software.

 

I think that Matt should change which files are encrypted and which ones are not. I like others have looked at other solutions that have better support.

 

In addition, CPanel should have bought out whmcs completely instead of just investing in it.

[Brainchild Labs Pty Ltd]

UUUUmmmmmm WTF is up with support.... ive had no updates for over 6 days now to a ticket... What gone bankrupt or sold the business or something ????

 

Ever since the CPANEL news support has gone to ****.

 

WTF is going on...... we NEED SUPPORT......

[easyhosting]

UUUUmmmmmm WTF is up with support.... ive had no updates for over 6 days now to a ticket... What gone bankrupt or sold the business or something ????

 

Ever since the CPANEL news support has gone to ****.

 

WTF is going on...... we NEED SUPPORT......

 

shouting is not going to help neither is starting a new thread

[slim]

Its getting a little ridiculous now thou wouldnt you say? It took me 3 weeks to get my last bug fixed (and yes, it was a bug, not user issue) and I now have two more tickets open - one for a bug and a another for a potential bug..

 

One opened 15th and another on the 16th and its now the 17th with no reply to either.. Im sorry, but 48 hours with no reply is not good enough. I feel for those waiting weeks for replies as I was one of those customers. Waiting 48 hours isnt good enough, and waiting weeks sure isnt either.

[Bubka3]

I get that everyone is frustrated, but what would you like us to do about it?

 

At least tell us your issue so we might be able to help you.

[slim]

I allready have with one of the issues see: http://forum.whmcs.com/showthread.php?55210-Bank-Deposit-Payments-Redirecting-to-gateway-ajax-displays&highlight=bank+deposit

 

At least one other person with the same issue.

 

The other issue is regarding the .net and .com whois - it is inconsistant - it keeps telling me .com or .net domains that i know are available are not available.. It doesnt always do it thou - See screenshot

[BusinessWebsiteDev.com]

Hello, I am pleased to see that I am not alone, but am unhappy to see that this is a widespread problem.

 

I have been waiting for 4+ days for most replies to my tickets. I was told that this was due to the latest release being prepared for release.

The latest delay for more than 12 days and I had to open a second ticket to force a reply. The new version has now been released and their excuse has changed from the upcoming release to the volume of tickets they are receiving.

 

Sorry, but 12+ days for a reply is entirely unacceptable. It was not too long ago that WHMCS was hacked and my personal details stolen. Granted, that was no direct fault of WHMCS, but they were entrusted with my personal details and due to their choice of host, my details were all stolen.

 

At the end of the day, I simply can not wait 12+ days for a reply. A 48 hour wait is long enough, but 12+ days and a second ticket is simply entirely unacceptable.

[BusinessWebsiteDev.com]

There were 9 pages and 122 replies earlier, now there are 8 pages and 120 replies. What is happening?

[BusinessWebsiteDev.com]

I just got the same message "Thank you for posting! Your post will not be visible until a moderator has approved it for posting. " when I tried to post. are they filtering keywords?

[easyhosting]

There were 9 pages and 122 replies earlier, now there are 8 pages and 120 replies. What is happening?

 

simple. SPAMMERS

 

the WHMCS forum has become the target for spammers which need to cleared up and removed once reported by other members. this also take the time of a WHMCS staff member away from checking support tickets.

[mylove4life]

I think bear helps with the spamming stuff too