New Order Configuration Questions

[Isaac Asher]

I have a couple questions on configuration for the new order process.  

I want to make it as smooth as possible for my customers, and my most recent customer has had a very disjointed experience so far. 

I created her account manually when we began our discussions.  She logged in and placed the order through WHMCS.  I use only PayPal for all payment processing, FYI.  It appears there was no credit card on file in WHMCS at the time of the order.  I created a special custom bundle for her and sent her a link to puchase the bundle. After she placed the order, it appeared as a new Pending order.  I approved it, and the system then sent the domain registration to the registrar and provisioned the cPanel account on the server. This is not what I was expecting or desiring.  Following that, it appears there was an invoice created on the system and the customer still has a balance due. I did not receive any PayPal transactions or attempted transactions, so it appears the payment didn't complete, but the order within WHMCS did complete.  

This is difficult to reconcile. 

Here's how I would rather see this go down: 

Since I personally created her account (maybe there is an option somewhere???), I would like any purchases she makes to be automatically provisioned upon receipt of the first payment, not upon the order being approved. (Incidentally, I did check the products she ordered, and all are set to provision upon first payment, so I don't know why this would have happened early). When she makes the purchase, the system should either ask her for a credit card or use the card on file and complete the transaction at that time.  Upon successful payment, the system should notify her (and hopefully me) of the new payment at which point I will begin my service to the client. 

 

Can anyone tell me how to adjust settings to make the desired flow?  Or help direct me to resources for more information about which settings I need to research? 

Many thanks from me and my future customers

[Brad (SaneChoice Limited)]

On 9/20/2018 at 8:30 PM, Isaac Asher said:

I created her account manually when we began our discussions.  She logged in and placed the order through WHMCS.  I use only PayPal for all payment processing, FYI.  It appears there was no credit card on file in WHMCS at the time of the order.  I created a special custom bundle for her and sent her a link to puchase the bundle. After she placed the order, it appeared as a new Pending order.  I approved it, and the system then sent the domain registration to the registrar and provisioned the cPanel account on the server. This is not what I was expecting or desiring.  Following that, it appears there was an invoice created on the system and the customer still has a balance due. I did not receive any PayPal transactions or attempted transactions, so it appears the payment didn't complete, but the order within WHMCS did complete.  

So there seems to be two problems you are describing here:

1. The order (hosting account and domain registration) was processed automatically after you accepted the order.
2. Despite the order being processed, you still had an outstanding balance left for the client to pay.  

Does that broadly describe the experience? 

[Isaac Asher]

Yes that is exactly correct. Seems like I have something set wrong! Any ideas?

[Vox]

Hi @Isaac Asher,

On 9/25/2018 at 11:37 AM, sanechoice said:

After she placed the order, it appeared as a new Pending order.

Yes, that is correct and if you have set the Module Settings (aka Provisioning) correctly the service will only be activated automatically after payment : https://docs.whmcs.com/Products_and_Services#Module_Settings_.28aka_Provisioning.29

• Quote

   

  • There are 4 automation settings to choose from for product activation and they are:
    • Automatically setup the product as soon as an order is placed - this will setup instantly usually used for free products
    • Automatically setup the product as soon as the first payment is received - this will perform the setup as soon as the order is paid for
    • Automatically setup the product when you manually accept a pending order - this will perform the setup only when an admin has manually reviewed and accepted the order
    • Do not automatically setup this product - never auto setup the product - admins can still initiate manually from the product details page under a clients profile

   

 

 

On 9/20/2018 at 8:30 PM, Isaac Asher said:

I approved it, and the system then sent the domain registration to the registrar and provisioned the cPanel account on the server.

Yes, that is correct. You will have seen that the order was unpaid and you would have had "tickboxes" to run module create and send the domain registration to the registrar - so that's exactly what you did by accepting the order, although it had not been paid for : https://docs.whmcs.com/Order_Management#Accepting_Pending_Orders

Edited September 26, 2018 by Vox

[Isaac Asher]

Thank you for your response, however I'm still very confused as to what exactly happens when an order is approved.  

14 hours ago, Vox said:

Yes, that is correct. You will have seen that the order was unpaid and you would have had "tickboxes" to run module create and send the domain registration to the registrar - so that's exactly what you did by accepting the order, although it had not been paid for : https://docs.whmcs.com/Order_Management#Accepting_Pending_Orders

 If by "tickboxes" you mean these: 

 at the product level, I have already confirmed that all of the products in the order were set up exactly as above: "Automatically setup the product as soon as the first payment is received." 

Does approving the order somehow count as a payment in WHMCS? Should I not approve an order until payment has been received? Not sure how to make that happen since the invoice wouldn't be generated until the order was approved. 

 

If I messed up something here, I just need to know how to prevent it from happening again.  

 

Thanks

[Vox]

Hi @Isaac Asher,

No, these ones where you manage a "Pending" Order

 

If you accept the Order, WHMCS will do as it is told..... Run Module Create and send the Registration to the Registrar.

Only accept the order after payment, which is clearly shown under payment status.

 

 

Edited September 27, 2018 by Vox

[Isaac Asher]

Okay, I believe I understand now a little bit better, but the logic behind it is still very unclear to me.

If the provisioning of accounts and registering of domains happens ultimately based on the tickboxes on the Order Items screen, then what is the purpose of the radio buttons shown in my earlier screenshot?  It seems to me the tickboxes override the radio buttons, so then why have the radio buttons at the product level at all?  

I would like to better understand the relationship between the tickboxes on the order items page and the radio buttons on the product setup. 

Ultimately I would also like to know what the "recommended" settings are, and what the checkout process looks like when they are in place?  If this information is detailed somewhere online, I would appreciate a link or some direction.  

 

Sorry to be such a noob, I just really need to understand the functioning of it so I know how to use it properly and to my advantage. 

 

Thank you kindly in advance. 

[Vox]

Hi @Isaac Asher,

10 hours ago, Isaac Asher said:

but the logic behind it is still very unclear to me

WHMCS is an automated system and will (typically) do you what you tell it to… so if you tell it to wait until after payment has been received before it creates a service, it will do that for you.

If you then choose to manually and override that instruction, it will let you - you’re in charge of your business and there may be a good reason why you want to do that.

10 hours ago, Isaac Asher said:

I just really need to understand the functioning of it so I know how to use it properly and to my advantage

I would suggest creating and managing orders in a whole range of scenarios in your test environment, so you can get to understand what the standard process is and how it works for you and how you wish to use it.

 

Edited September 28, 2018 by Vox

[Vox]

On 9/27/2018 at 2:26 AM, Isaac Asher said:

Does approving the order somehow count as a payment in WHMCS?

No, It does what you tell it to do but still leaves the invoice as unpaid.

On 9/27/2018 at 2:26 AM, Isaac Asher said:

Should I not approve an order until payment has been received?

Yes.

On 9/27/2018 at 2:26 AM, Isaac Asher said:

since the invoice wouldn't be generated until the order was approved

No, the invoice is generated when the order is placed.

[Isaac Asher]

On 9/27/2018 at 5:33 PM, Isaac Asher said:

I would like to better understand the relationship between the tickboxes on the order items page and the radio buttons on the product setup.

I really need someone to explain this part to me. This is the key to understanding, I believe, so I'm asking the community at large for further explanation or direction to resources. 

Thanks. 

[WHMCS ChrisD]

Hi @Isaac Asher

https://docs.whmcs.com/Products_Management & https://docs.whmcs.com/Custom_Fields & https://docs.whmcs.com/Addons_and_Configurable_Options should assist you with understanding these.  

Taking some details from the Add-ons & Configurable OPtions

Radio

When the Radio option type is selected a list of the available options option are displayed alongside a radio box for the client to choose from. However if there are too many a long list can look messy, consider using a Dropdown instead.

Yes/No

Use the Yes/No option type to display a checkbox for the client to tick or leave unticked, useful for simple opt-in/out questions. Both yes or no are valid items so the form validation will accept the unticked state even if this is a required option.

[Isaac Asher]

To clarify, I wasn't asking in general about the differences between tickboxes and radio buttons.  

I was asking about the difference and relationship between the specific tickboxes on the pending order page in the attached screenshot, and the specific radio buttons from the module options set at the product level.  

It was (and remains) confusing for me that there would be an option to "setup the product when you manually accept a pending order" at the product level, and then additional tickboxes to be selected at the time you manually accept a pending order. It confuses me that there should be a repeated setting at two levels of the order hierarchy, and I can't be sure how this benefits, but my best guess is just to give the seller more options to change the process flow at any point in the process.  I guess. 

It's not very clear to me, my tests were confusing and unfruitful, and the links above didn't have the info I'm looking for.  

I guess the only thing I can do is keep trying, I'm just frustrated after having read so many pages of docs and forums and I just can't seem to find clarity on this issue.  There are no WHMCS videos about this or even about the checkout/order approval process flows, so I can't see it in action. If I missed them, I'd sure love it if someone could post a link. 

Sorry to be such a noob.  Thanks for everyone's help. I do appreciate your time and effort. 

 

[Kian]

You are confusing auto-provisioning and manual intervention.

Auto-provisionig is the one you set from product settings with the four radio buttons. It says to WHMCS if it needs to automatically setup the product in question and at what conditions (eg. After payment, order or your manual approval).

The checkboxes you see from order page give you, as an administrator with full permissions, the possibility to override this behaviour. Do you want to setup the order even though "Do not automatically setup this product" is enabled? You can. Or maybe you want to setup the hosting account even though provisioning is set to "as soon as first payment is received" and the invoice is still unpaid. You can, you are the administrator! 

Long story short WHMCS performs automatic actions according to your settings but in the same time from order page you can override everything and do what you want.

[Vox]

Hi @Isaac Asher,

I am a little confused as you seem to want to use an automated system on one hand but then wish to manually override this for some reason, which I am at a loss to understand why.

Why not leave the automated system to do it’s job? Unless of course you do not wish to use WHMCS and in which case you can do all of this manually using WHM.

If it is purely an understanding issue, I would recommend setting out and testing a range of scenarios as I advised you previously. This way you can place test orders and learn and understand how they would be managed by you in “real life”.

I advised you to use your test system to scenario test this so you can understand what happens....

On 9/28/2018 at 9:51 AM, Vox said:

I would suggest creating and managing orders in a whole range of scenarios in your test environment, so you can get to understand what the standard process is and how it works for you and how you wish to use it.

But you have said….

23 hours ago, Isaac Asher said:

It's not very clear to me, my tests were confusing and unfruitful

Well you talk about logic and process flows, so have you tried to map this out for yourself and think about what your own business process flows are?

Lets try and help you by limiting this down to a simple example. Let’s just focus on the provision of a hosting service as the provisioning of a domain registration (or transfer) is more or less the same.

So if you are accustomed to process flows let us try and spell this out as to how I manage my business with an “automated billing and control system” - this means that I do not have to manually intervene in each and every order............ Of course you can manage your business however you choose!

Scenario 1 - Order placed by a customer but no payment received:

1a. Do nothing. Wait until the payment has been received - why would I provide a service without payment?

So in Order Management I would leave this as “Pending”. It will sit there until payment has been made….. (depending upon your GDPR settings for inactive clients as the order may be deleted but that is something that is really not relevant at the moment to your understanding of processing an order).

1b. I trust the customer and that the payment is “incoming”, i.e. they will give me the cash tonight, or they will mail in a payment, or they will make a bank transfer.

So in Order Management, within that scenario I will “ACCEPT” the order and setup their hosting but will leave the payment status as “Incomplete” until I have received payment and will then mark the invoice as “paid”. I want the services to be activated before I have physically received payment.

Scenario 2 - Order placed by a customer and payment received:

2a. Under your current settings the service would be provisioned and the Hosting Account Information email sent to the client etc, and everything is good to go.

In Order Management I would review this and if everything looks ok I would “ACCEPT” the order.

2b. Under your settings the service would be provisioned and the Hosting Account Information email sent to the client etc, and everything is good to go.

However, in Order Management when I reviewed this, something would not be right from my perspective or would violate my T’s & C’s. Possibly a phishing, scamming or inappropriate site e.g. myscammingpaypalsite.com etc or would involve drugs, racism etc and in that case I would either “Cancel”, or “Cancel & Refund” or “Set as Fraud” etc.

That is the whole point of WHMCS..................

You can sit back and have the minimal intervention once you have set your “parameters” and just review the process flows. Or you can override an automated system - the choice is yours.

[Isaac Asher]

3 hours ago, Vox said:

I am a little confused as you seem to want to use an automated system on one hand but then wish to manually override this for some reason, which I am at a loss to understand why.

I readily admit I am learning the system, and until today, really didn't understand the flow of ordering process as @Vox explained so thoroughly above.  Thank you!  Between this and @Kian pointing out the specific point of my confusion, I think I finally have a handle on this.  I never understood the purpose of accepting an order when it was already paid and provisioned, but now it makes a lot more sense.  

I'm glad to have this community available for helping us poor, lost noobies.  Looking forward to giving back after I get a little experience under my belt. 

Thanks everyone