Email Marketing Tool has no opt-out option

[Inetbiz]

Because we can setup triggers to send out upgrade/addon sales emails, the code totally forgot to insert upon registration whether or not it is OK to send marketing and promotional emails with the ability to opt-out at any time in the future.

 

I've started using it in others ways such as capture an SSL renewal order. But, if I create marketing type emails to solicit a sale, I'm sending unsolicited commercial email and U.S. federal statutes require that I provide a method to OPT-OUT automatically or include a physical address and phone information to manually request removal from marketing emails AKA Can Spam Act of 2008 I believe is the year?

[merlinpa1969]

Since you already have a business relationship with the client you can send the first email with no issues, however you are correct in stating that there needs to be an opt out link in the email

[jasonhk]

I agree to this, an opt-out link would work best. If a customer signs up for a service they would except to receive service/product related emails.

[easyhosting]

Because we can setup triggers to send out upgrade/addon sales emails, the code totally forgot to insert upon registration whether or not it is OK to send marketing and promotional emails with the ability to opt-out at any time in the future.

 

I've started using it in others ways such as capture an SSL renewal order. But, if I create marketing type emails to solicit a sale, I'm sending unsolicited commercial email and U.S. federal statutes require that I provide a method to OPT-OUT automatically or include a physical address and phone information to manually request removal from marketing emails AKA Can Spam Act of 2008 I believe is the year?

 

check out http://forum.whmcs.com/showthread.php?p=199277 you can have this option through a MOD also its version 5.0.2

[Inetbiz]

Thanks easyhosting but I'll wait till WHMCS team updates email marketer with a sensible opt-out solution.

[easyhosting]

yes but note

 

Thanks for bringing this to my attention. Those layouts and email formats would actually lend themselves quite well to the newsletter addon

 

But not sure those emails would lend themselves very well to the default email templates

 

so can be used in newletter addon but NOT emails

[ExsysHost]

yes but note

 

 

 

 

 

so can be used in newletter addon but NOT emails

 

 

You don't make any sense here, the topic poster is asking about the mass mail tool which is the Email Marketing Tool which is the newsletter tool.

 

So yes he will be implementing what the topic poster is asking about based on the thread I started.

 

And in regards to the default emails that go out... well that is still in discussion in the other thread which is above and beyond what this topic poster requested so it is not relevant here. But I agree there should be an unsubscribe from the default templates as well.

[ExsysHost]

For those wanting more information on this duplicate thread.. there is already another topic covering this: http://forum.whmcs.com/showthread.php?t=43137

 

It covers CAN-SPAM and unsubscribe as well as many other features regarding compliant emails, and deliveribility.

 

Matt has already stated that the features will be implemented in the Mass email tool, but if you want them in the default emails as well you will have to participate in the discussion.

[easyhosting]

You don't make any sense here, the topic poster is asking about the mass mail tool which is the Email Marketing Tool which is the newsletter tool.

 

So yes he will be implementing what the topic poster is asking about based on the thread I started.

 

And in regards to the default emails that go out... well that is still in discussion in the other thread which is above and beyond what this topic poster requested so it is not relevant here. But I agree there should be an unsubscribe from the default templates as well.

 

 

 

their is a good mod out their that works with the email templates you just need to add a {} code in the templates which i use in mass mail.

 

i have been using this for many months and it works a treat. i stopped using the newsletter mod from the community addons as it does not work effectively, so if one is going to be implemented into WHMCS as stand well this will be a good thing.

[ExsysHost]

I think I know where your mis-understanding is, the requester is inquiring about sending out Marketing emails through the Mass mail tool... which is what Matt's intentions of it are for v5

 

this has nothing to do with any mod.

 

 

The topic requester wants CAN-SPAM rules to be applied to the Mass Mail tool... which is what I requested in my thread along with several other improvements.

 

The mod deleted the post, but what Matt said was he is going to be implementing the CAN-SPAM rules into the mass mail tool as well as adding a cron job so it will also function as a newsletter tool.

[easyhosting]

I think I know where your mis-understanding is, the requester is inquiring about sending out Marketing emails through the Mass mail tool... which is what Matt's intentions of it are for v5

 

this has nothing to do with any mod.

 

 

The topic requester wants CAN-SPAM rules to be applied to the Mass Mail tool... which is what I requested in my thread along with several other improvements.

 

The mod deleted the post, but what Matt said was he is going to be implementing the CAN-SPAM rules into the mass mail tool as well as adding a cron job so it will also function as a newsletter tool.

 

 

trouble with the CAN-SPAM act is a USA act which i agree would be a great feature, but currently in the UK their is no legal requirement for this to be followed

 

Also

 

If the message contains only commercial content, its primary purpose is commercial and it must comply with the requirements of CAM-SPAM. If it contains only transactional or relationship content, its primary purpose is transactional or relationship. In that case, it may not contain false or misleading routing information, but is otherwise exempt from most provisions of the CAN-SPAM Act.

 

so if you are sending a security notice or a plain information notice then it is exempt from most provisions of the CAN-SPAM Act

 

http://business.ftc.gov/documents/bus61-can-spam-act-compliance-guide-business

Edited November 28, 2011 by easyhosting

[ExsysHost]

True,

 

but while not required by law, it is an easy fix to help keep your mail server from falsy being flagged as a spam server... by including the proper un-subscribe features in any correspondences being sent out then popular mail clients like hotmail, gmail, yahoo while notify you of a users desire to not receive emails from you instead of flagging your server as spam.

 

This is a tricky subject that really needs to be well thought out and discussed to come up with a great solution that works well and helps maintain the companies email reputation.

 

 

While true that non solicited mail does not fall under the can SPAM rules, it would benefit for the same reasons as above.

 

So the question would be couldn't WHMCS provide a merge tag for both the mass mail tool and the default emails that when triggered by one of the email providers auto unsubscribe features, or by the user clicking un-subscribe in the email that WHMCS in turn suspended outgoing emails for that user and raised an alert in the billing system so the admin could phone the user and ask why they are reporting the emails as spam instead of the email server being flagged as spam.

[Inetbiz]

The new email marketing tool is what I meant. Security and other emails can be sent through the client mass mail tool. Whether it be a countries law or not, it makes good sense to be polite and offer a way out of not receiving sales emails that do not affect them.

 

But this new tool has other purposes that I saw? A renewal reminder by setting an email to send XX days before the renewal date. So... I request that it be within the configuration of a new email marketing object. Each time I can click to include an opt-out insertion.

[merlinpa1969]

Im planning on using it to upsell SSL certificates on users with hosting and a ded IP address and NO SSL after 60 days with a reminder that the dedicated IP that they are using has to be justified

[easyhosting]

True,

 

but while not required by law, it is an easy fix to help keep your mail server from falsy being flagged as a spam server... by including the proper un-subscribe features in any correspondences being sent out then popular mail clients like hotmail, gmail, yahoo while notify you of a users desire to not receive emails from you instead of flagging your server as spam.

 

This is a tricky subject that really needs to be well thought out and discussed to come up with a great solution that works well and helps maintain the companies email reputation.

 

 

While true that non solicited mail does not fall under the can SPAM rules, it would benefit for the same reasons as above.

 

So the question would be couldn't WHMCS provide a merge tag for both the mass mail tool and the default emails that when triggered by one of the email providers auto unsubscribe features, or by the user clicking un-subscribe in the email that WHMCS in turn suspended outgoing emails for that user and raised an alert in the billing system so the admin could phone the user and ask why they are reporting the emails as spam instead of the email server being flagged as spam.

 

i already have an unsubscribe system setup using a mod, which gives an unsubscribe link in each mass mail i send out, It also sets up question in the order form allowing new users to opt out of certain emails, which i have made separate groups for opt outs so mass mail is not sent to anyone who choses not to receive mailings.

 

Also as CAN-SPAM is a USA act even if it is implemented in WHMCS then if you are UK based you are under no obligation to follow this. personally i think CAN-SPAM should be worldwide

[ExsysHost]

i already have an unsubscribe system setup using a mod, which gives an unsubscribe link in each mass mail i send out, It also sets up question in the order form allowing new users to opt out of certain emails, which i have made separate groups for opt outs so mass mail is not sent to anyone who choses not to receive mailings.

 

Also as CAN-SPAM is a USA act even if it is implemented in WHMCS then if you are UK based you are under no obligation to follow this. personally i think CAN-SPAM should be worldwide

 

 

Which mod?

 

I know it is not required outside of USA, but you as an email sender benefit from it regardless... your email server has a reputation... if you do everything in your power to implement technologies that make it easy for users to un-subscribe or stop receiving emails from you, then you are less likely to have your email server flagged as a spam server and therefore prevent future emails to other users from landing in their spam boxes.

 

Big email companies like, gmail, yahoo, hotmail regardless of what country you are in will automatically notify you of a users wish to no longer receive email if you include the can spam urls.. and they do so politely without flagging your server with spam points as the user flagged your email as spam.

 

So in other words this helps keep your email servers good reputation so why would it matter if it is required... wouldnt you want to do everything in your power to keep your email servers reputation in good standing and be notified of a users wish to not receive emails before landing your server in the penalty box and your future emails going to the spam folder?

[easyhosting]

Which mod?

 

I know it is not required outside of USA, but you as an email sender benefit from it regardless... your email server has a reputation... if you do everything in your power to implement technologies that make it easy for users to un-subscribe or stop receiving emails from you, then you are less likely to have your email server flagged as a spam server and therefore prevent future emails to other users from landing in their spam boxes.

 

Big email companies like, gmail, yahoo, hotmail regardless of what country you are in will automatically notify you of a users wish to no longer receive email if you include the can spam urls.. and they do so politely without flagging your server with spam points as the user flagged your email as spam.

 

So in other words this helps keep your email servers good reputation so why would it matter if it is required... wouldnt you want to do everything in your power to keep your email servers reputation in good standing and be notified of a users wish to not receive emails before landing your server in the penalty box and your future emails going to the spam folder?

 

 

yes CAN SPAM does benefit a lot, but read what i said "if you are UK based you are under no obligation to follow this"

 

gmail, yahoo, hotmail do use this as guess what they are USA based companies so must implement CAN SPAM. WHMCS is UK based

 

the MOD as mentioned before http://forum.whmcs.com/showthread.php?p=199277

Edited November 28, 2011 by easyhosting

[ExsysHost]

I understand that its not law in the UK... and I dont quite understand why my posts regarding that keep getting deleted, its quite annoying.

 

But just because it is not law in the UK doesnt mean that you in the UK would not benefit from it, by making sure that your emails had an unsubscribe link in them... then your email servers reputation would be in much better standing as you would be notified of a persons wish to no longer receive email from you, instead of your server being flagged as a spam server and all your other customers who receive email from the same provider your emails ending up in their spam boxes.

 

So you as an email sender should be more concerned with the deliverability of your emails and your email servers reputation regardless of what UK laws state

[easyhosting]

I understand that its not law in the UK... and I dont quite understand why my posts regarding that keep getting deleted, its quite annoying.

 

But just because it is not law in the UK doesnt mean that you in the UK would not benefit from it, by making sure that your emails had an unsubscribe link in them... then your email servers reputation would be in much better standing as you would be notified of a persons wish to no longer receive email from you, instead of your server being flagged as a spam server and all your other customers who receive email from the same provider your emails ending up in their spam boxes.

 

So you as an email sender should be more concerned with the deliverability of your emails and your email servers reputation regardless of what UK laws state

 

as stated their is modes that actually do this. yes we can all benefit from this, but as its not law in the UK then it6 can be ignored and not adhered too.

[ExsysHost]

as stated their is modes that actually do this. yes we can all benefit from this, but as its not law in the UK then it6 can be ignored and not adhered too.

 

So I am confused as to why you are so apposed to a small addition of a merge tag being added that has a url that allows admins to be notified of a users wish to no longer receive mail..

 

it is not like you are being forced to use the feature? do you use all the features in the system now?

 

WHy are you so apposed to a email system becoming a better email system? As it is an email system it is its job to handle deliverability not a 3rd party mod. a mod that can become outdated, a mod that we have no idea of the quality of.. I trust my email system to WHMCS not to a mod.

[brianr]

Let me put it this way...

 

In some EU countries (not sure, but Germany comes to mind, specifically), you must use sequential invoice numbers. It's a law (or a tax law - either way a governmental requirement).

 

In the US we don't need to, and AFAIK in the UK you don't need to either, but WHMCS was retooled to allow for this.

 

Now along the same vane, in the US we MUST have an opt-out/unsubscribe link in any marketing emails we send. (The 1st email exemption is dubious as the welcome email on signup may count against that.)

 

You don't see us here complaining about invoice numbering options that we don't use, but at the same time people were complaining before that feature was added that they couldn't use the software in <Insert Country Here>.

 

Now the shoe is on the other foot, and we're stuck with unusable features all the for want of an unsubscribe/opt-out link or merge field.

 

Seriously, if you don't want it - ignore it. We're not asking it be in the default template (but a note in the docs for US customers explaining how to do it would be appropriate then), so what would it matter to you?

 

And lastly, requiring the use of a 3rd party module just to add an unsub/opt-out link on a supported feature seems a tad excessive, don't you think? Really, how long it would it take Matt & crew to add a merge field and quick UI to handle this?

[easyhosting]

Let me put it this way...

 

In some EU countries (not sure, but Germany comes to mind, specifically), you must use sequential invoice numbers. It's a law (or a tax law - either way a governmental requirement).

 

In the US we don't need to, and AFAIK in the UK you don't need to either, but WHMCS was retooled to allow for this.

 

Now along the same vane, in the US we MUST have an opt-out/unsubscribe link in any marketing emails we send. (The 1st email exemption is dubious as the welcome email on signup may count against that.)

 

You don't see us here complaining about invoice numbering options that we don't use, but at the same time people were complaining before that feature was added that they couldn't use the software in <Insert Country Here>.

 

Now the shoe is on the other foot, and we're stuck with unusable features all the for want of an unsubscribe/opt-out link or merge field.

 

Seriously, if you don't want it - ignore it. We're not asking it be in the default template (but a note in the docs for US customers explaining how to do it would be appropriate then), so what would it matter to you?

 

And lastly, requiring the use of a 3rd party module just to add an unsub/opt-out link on a supported feature seems a tad excessive, don't you think? Really, how long it would it take Matt & crew to add a merge field and quick UI to handle this?

 

 

if it was added as a feature yes it would be used, but as its not yet then i use a mod for this. i have never said CAN SPAM is not useful infact i have said the opposite if you read my posts, what i said was that in the UK it is not a requirement.

[stormy]

I suppose this will get added sooner than later. It's useful for everyone: even if it's legal to do si, why would you want to email a customer that does not want you to email him? Also, I'm pretty sure it will be mandatory in the UK as well in the short term.