nhudson Posted January 7, 2012 Share Posted January 7, 2012 However all WHMCS users are able to get product support from us directly. Just reseller customers receive a lower priority than direct customers. Typically those who go through resellers wait twice as long for support responses as direct customers, so while you get the exact same product, people get a better service, and access to various special offers and discounts, for the extra money they pay in coming direct to us. As I've told you before, Matt, a customer is a customer. It does NOT matter if they purchase from you or a reseller. Regardless of where the license was purchased, you are still receiving payment for their license and still generating a source of revenue from them. As I've stated many times before, you need to learn the fundamentals of customer service. You should be treating all your customers equally. A reseller's customer is still your customer, whether you want to believe that or not, and treating them as second-class is plain WRONG. You might be the largest hosting management software right now. But then again - WHM AutoPilot, ClientExec, and ModernBill all had their days in the spotlight too. That was until something new came along with more features and better support. Some day, Matt, your day will come too - and a product will come along that doesn't treat certain customers as second-class based on who they purchased a license from - and you're going to lose the business of all those people that you treated poorly just because they bought from a reseller. If you don't want to treat your resellers' customers as equals, then stop offering a reseller program. It started off with them not getting domain reseller accounts or dev licenses or being able to transfer licenses. Now you've stooped so low as to degrade the level of service that they receive? That's pathetic. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WebsiteIntegrations Posted January 8, 2012 Share Posted January 8, 2012 So if you buy your hosting from a reseller do you expect the company they ordered their reseller account from to provide you direct support or would you get the support from the company you ordered the hosting from? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
merlinpa1969 Posted January 8, 2012 Share Posted January 8, 2012 try getting support from cPanel if you have a third party license.... Doesnt work, we HAVE to go through softlayer and those dimwits spend 3 days going over what we already tried 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sliffer21 Posted January 8, 2012 Share Posted January 8, 2012 Well the whole point of reselling, (If you think about it) is to sell much more of the service to a wider area and the re sellers serve almost as the middle man for support between the end user and the root seller. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sparky Posted January 8, 2012 Share Posted January 8, 2012 So if you buy your hosting from a reseller do you expect the company they ordered their reseller account from to provide you direct support or would you get the support from the company you ordered the hosting from? Take a look here http://www.whmcs.com/resellers/ In particular at the bottom of the page Q: Who supports the end user?A: We do! There’s no point having a great product for people to use if they can’t get the support they need to get it running in the first place so we provide full support to your resold customers just the same as if they had signed up directly with us. We also have an active community forum where they can obtain help from others. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nhudson Posted January 8, 2012 Share Posted January 8, 2012 (edited) try getting support from cPanel if you have a third party license.... cPanel provides STELLAR support to ALL cPanel licenseholders. I've put 2 tickets in to cPanel this month (with a license from my datacenter) and got them resolved in under 2 hours. They don't discriminate. Also, comparing a hosting reseller to a license reseller is a bad comparison. In the case of a hosting reseller, it is typically told upfront that the reseller is to provide support to their customers. Read this page, right on WHMCS website: http://www.whmcs.com/resellers/ Q: Who supports the end user?A: We do! There’s no point having a great product for people to use if they can’t get the support they need to get it running in the first place so we provide full support to your resold customers just the same as if they had signed up directly with us. We also have an active community forum where they can obtain help from others. They PUBLICLY advertise that "we provide full support to your resold customers just the same as if they had signed up directly with us". Only after the fact do the resellers find out that their customers will be treated as second-class. Tell me again - How is what they're doing right? Or is everyone still caught up in the "Oh, Matt is our HERO, and he can do NO WRONG, because he is the owner of WHMCS!" garbage? They advertise that they'll treat resold customers the same, but that's clearly a blatant and flat out lie based on what Matt said. Low, dirty, unethical, greedy business practices is what this amounts to. I remember when WHMCS first came out, and Matt was a reasonable guy. I actually talked to him on AIM a couple times, and at that time, he seemed to care more about providing a solid product than how much money he was making. I think that his fame and fortune has corrupted his morals and basic business ethics. It's REALLY a shame how money changes people. Hey Matt - I know that you make a CONSIDERABLE amount of profit every year. How much of that would be lost if all your resellers pulled all their customers out and brought them to another solution that didn't treat their resold customers like unimportants? Hmmm.... PS: Before you try and delete everything or change the website before replying, I took screenshots Edited January 8, 2012 by nhudson 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
merlinpa1969 Posted January 8, 2012 Share Posted January 8, 2012 dud either put in your ticket or stop whining simple as that 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nhudson Posted January 8, 2012 Share Posted January 8, 2012 dud either put in your ticket or stop whining simple as that Oh, I don't have a support issue ... anymore. I was treated like a piece of garbage just like the person that started this thread. I chose to speak with my money, and I got out. And, this isn't whining. Nobody in here is "whining". WHMCS is engaging in FALSE ADVERTISING, openly advertising that they'll offer support to resold customers just the same as their own, then reneging on that advertising down the road. That's dirty, that's unethical, and that's wrong. If you think it's OK, then that's your opinion. I certainly hope you don't treat your customers the same way. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WebsiteIntegrations Posted January 8, 2012 Share Posted January 8, 2012 and you think you could have afforded the extra couple dollars to buy it direct especially if your making money providing modules for the script .... I chose to speak with my money, and I got out. and your still here why? for free advertising to make money off this product? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nhudson Posted January 8, 2012 Share Posted January 8, 2012 and you think you could have afforded the extra couple dollars to buy it direct especially if your making money providing modules for the script .... I bought from LicensePal because Jay and I have a great working relationship. Not to "save a couple bucks". I bought through a reseller because I *always* help out those businesses that help me out. Never used to be an issue, until now Matt's decided that he wants more more more money - and that resellers' customers can't expect the same level of support as his own (even though he advertises that they'll get it) 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nhudson Posted January 8, 2012 Share Posted January 8, 2012 and your still here why? for free advertising to make money off this product? I developed and advertised these modules BEFORE Matt decided to start treating me like garbage. Maybe everyone else will tolerate that, but I sure won't. And - I'm here because I'm entitled to be. I've still got a valid WHMCS license (for now anyways, it's even a direct license too!) - and I'm posting FEEDBACK, just like the forum title states - "Good or bad". Matt needs to learn that there ARE other solutions out there that are just as good, and provide BETTER support, and aren't cocky and arrogant like he's become -- and he can lose money that he would otherwise be getting (from a direct or resold customer) by treating them like second-class citizens. I'm glad to be ported off of WHMCS, and glad that the install I have up is only for testing purposes because, unlike Matt, I make sure that ALL of my customers are taken care of - not just the ones that make me the most money 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
merlinpa1969 Posted January 8, 2012 Share Posted January 8, 2012 dude seriously stop being a troll 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nhudson Posted January 8, 2012 Share Posted January 8, 2012 dude seriously stop being a troll How am I trolling? I'm stating FACTS, based on PERSONAL EXPERIENCE. I'm sorry you have that "I love Matt" worship, but I don't. He's wrong. He's gone against what he's publicly advertised. And I'm calling him out on it. I'm sorry you can't see facts when they're right in front of you. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clubuptime Posted January 8, 2012 Share Posted January 8, 2012 and you think you could have afforded the extra couple dollars to buy it direct especially if your making money providing modules for the script .... and your still here why? for free advertising to make money off this product? I think you're just missing the point here: The point is that WHMCS Advertises themselves as offering equal support to all of those who utilize the product, regardless of where the product was purchased. With Matt publicly advertising that he is not doing so, that statement then becomes what is known as "False Advertising". Definition of "False Advertising": False advertising or deceptive advertising is the use of false or misleading statements in advertising.... False advertising, in the most blatant of contexts, is illegal in most countries. (source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/False_advertising) So you're saying that even though Nick holds a 100% valid point in that Matt is promoting falsified claims, Nick is here to do nothing but be a common troll? I think the law supersedes your opinion here. There's even a website dedicated to False Advertising for United Kingdom residents since it's Illegal. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WebsiteIntegrations Posted January 8, 2012 Share Posted January 8, 2012 dude seriously stop being a troll Hey now, he is apparently 'entitled' to be a troll and bash something while also making money off it ... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nhudson Posted January 8, 2012 Share Posted January 8, 2012 Hey now, he is apparently 'entitled' to be a troll and bash something while also making money off it ... So when someone states facts that you don't agree with, that makes them a troll? lol. I'm not bashing the product. I'm bashing the unethical false advertising of the level of support provided to resold customers, and the unprofessional way that Matt is treating resold customers. Simple as that. Again, sorry you guys worship Matt and can't see that he's wrong. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
merlinpa1969 Posted January 8, 2012 Share Posted January 8, 2012 welll im out, not gonna feed the troll anymore and I dont have an I Love Matt complex but what I am sick of is you stating that you have moved on.... well move on 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nhudson Posted January 8, 2012 Share Posted January 8, 2012 welll im out, not gonna feed the troll anymore and I dont have an I Love Matt complex but what I am sick of is you stating that you have moved on.... well move on I'm still entitled to voice my opinion on the level of service that I received while I was using WHMCS. I'm sorry that you don't agree with me, but that doesn't make me a troll. As the forum description says "Feedback helps us to improve WHMCS." Hopefully Matt can learn from the loss of one customer how to change his attitude to prevent losing more. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FazeWire Web Services Posted January 8, 2012 Share Posted January 8, 2012 I am going to have to agree with nhudson here... This isn't a matter of trolling or 'loving Matt'. This is WHMCS saying one thing on their website, and doing another thing in practice. There isn't any debate about it, the website has been quoted and Matt has been quoted saying opposite things. WHMCS is in the wrong here. I am curious to see how they remedy this situation. PS: Our license is direct, so I can't possibly be trolling. We aren't affected by any of this, except poor business morals. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
merlinpa1969 Posted January 8, 2012 Share Posted January 8, 2012 saying it once is feedback, 2x maybe its the broken record turn it over or off 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nhudson Posted January 8, 2012 Share Posted January 8, 2012 saying it once is feedback, 2x maybe its the broken record turn it over or off I stated it once. Then people replied here trying to discredit my opinion, and I stood behind it and backed it up. I don't go into a debate if I'm not prepared to back my opinion up. If someone tries to discredit what I'm saying, I back it up. Simple as that. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WHMCS CEO Matt Posted January 8, 2012 WHMCS CEO Share Posted January 8, 2012 Oh, I don't have a support issue ... anymore. I was treated like a piece of garbage just like the person that started this thread. I chose to speak with my money, and I got out. And, this isn't whining. Nobody in here is "whining". WHMCS is engaging in FALSE ADVERTISING, openly advertising that they'll offer support to resold customers just the same as their own, then reneging on that advertising down the road. That's dirty, that's unethical, and that's wrong. Nick, you're overlooking a small but fundamental point in all of this. There are 2 very different types of reseller, a web host provider who bundles the product with the services they provide, and a public distributor. You don't use a web host provider "reseller", you use a "distributor", and the page you're referring to is describing the reseller program only, very different to the distributor program. Indeed resellers customers do get full support, as does everyone, distributor users included, but it is just that customers of third party distributors are treated with a lower priority for support than those who buy directly from us. There's nowhere do we say that a distributors customers will receive the same priority support, and it is a distributors responsibility to let you know what the service they provide will include, as there's a number of things - not just lower priority support - that you forego by purchasing from them instead. The point is simple, you are buying the exact same product, without limitations, but for a cheaper price. If there were no difference in the service you receive, then there would be no reason for anyone to buy directly. So we have these differentiators in service and benefits offered to reward those buying directly from us, those who are paying the full but still very reasonable price for our software, and in doing so helping to fund the future development and improvements to the product. And despite what you try to imply, this isn't something that big bad Matt has decided to do because he's "corrupt", it has always been the case, it's probably just more pronounced of a difference these days as we're dealing with 500 tickets a day as opposed to 50. Neither you, nor the thread opener, have ever been treated like a piece of garbage. Nobody who contacts us for help ever is. The thread op opened a ticket the day before Christmas Eve, had an initial response within 15 minutes, and had a resolution by boxing day. You reported 3 bugs on December 1st, and had them all looked into, debugged and a fix provided, all within 5 days, at a time of very high ticket volume due to the new release. You can say what you like about me, you don't know me. But I'm not going to engage in a war of words with you. Like you say, you're entitled to your opinion, but you don't need to be quite so obnoxious and vitriolic with it. Matt 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nhudson Posted January 8, 2012 Share Posted January 8, 2012 (edited) Just reseller customers receive a lower priority than direct customers. you use a "distributor" So you change your story from resellers customers receive lower priority support to now only distributors customers receive lower priority support? Even though you told me many many times when I worked at one of your larger web host resellers that they, too, should expect the same lower priority treatment? You're contradicting yourself. I'll just leave it at - what you're doing has already cost you one customer - and it's bound to cost you more. I guarantee I'm not alone. Edited January 8, 2012 by nhudson 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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